08/03/2026
In this episode of The Ministry Growth Show, Zach Leighton sits down with Todd Hall, professor of psychology at Biola University and author of Relational Spirituality and The Connected Life. Todd opens with his own story of distance from God in college, despite a Christian upbringing, faithful service, and a growing knowledge of Scripture. That early experience became the seed of decades of academic and ministry work integrating attachment theory, neuroscience, and Christian formation. He brings to the conversation the rare combination of clinical depth, theological care, and personal humility that the church needs more of right now.
The bulk of the conversation centers on what Todd calls the split between explicit knowledge and implicit knowledge — between what we believe about God and what we have actually learned to expect from connection. He explains how the relationships that formed us before we could think about formation continue to shape what we feel in prayer, how we receive love from God, and how willing we are to be vulnerable with the people we lead. The gap between head and heart, he argues, is not a faith failure. It is the place where real growth begins.
Zach and Todd also explore the integration of story, structure, and healing — how telling our story coherently in safe community is part of how secure attachment is rebuilt, and how the Bible itself has assumed this all along. The conversation lands on a hopeful and pastoral invitation for ministry leaders: the work of closing the gap between what we know about God and how close we feel to him is slow, relational, and worth doing. It begins with the leader's own story, not the church's next program.
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